[MORNING AFTER] Browns (22) at Packers (24)

  1. Everytime we lose the browns do just enough they should win, but mistakes make the loss somehow hurt more

  2. 100% this was gonna be a patriots level embarrassment. Was excited to half pay attention and play video games. Nope. Close the entire time just to choke it on bad play calling.

  3. I feel like we have had a lot of 2 minute drive opportunities to win the game. I also feel that we have capitalized on 0 of them.

  4. Check out my previous posts. I've broken them all down. Baker is 2-14 with 6 INTs in his career with the ball in his hands under 2 mins to tie or win the game.

  5. Assuming this Steelers chiefs game holds up, Browns need to beat Steelers and Bengals; have Chiefs beat Bengals and Rams beat Ravens 🤞

  6. Winning the next two games will go a long way in restoring goodwill with this coaching staff, Baker etc. even if we miss the playoffs. Two division wins to end the year will leave everyone with a much better taste going into the offseason. Let’s go Stefanski prove it man please.

  7. If Stefanski’s first 2 seasons are a playoff win and a winning record, I’m thrilled. That’s huge for this franchise and it points us in the right direction.

  8. Honestly winning both the next games and not making the playoffs would be worse for the team, imo. If we end the season greater than .500 a lot of people will forget all of the issues that need fixed and there will be less pressure on the team to fix it. There have to be changes this off season or else we will have wasted the primes of a few amazing players and will get nothing for it.

  9. I was a “run the damn ball” person, but if Mayfield actually hits Chubb, Njoku 2x we fly down the field. The run opened those plays up and we jus couldn’t do it

  10. If the game plan going forward has to be “Take the ball out of our QBs hands because we can’t trust him” we have way bigger issues than winning that game yesterday.

  11. Thank god, logic and reason is finally starting to emerge from this sub. It’s like people don’t understand you have to have a modicum of a passing game in order to win football games, you can’t just run 90% of a game and still find holes in the defense. The run game did its job, baker has to do his at the end. Those plays were open. End of story.

  12. The comments I keep seeing about the game are “Stefanski is terrible we should have run the ball more at the end of the game.” While I agree running at least one down was needed, it feels terrible that we have to try and take the ball out of our QBs hands so we don’t lose. We are giving Baker every opportunity to prove that he is a true Franchise QB and well…

  13. Funny thing was last week we ran three times and everyone went "Why didn't they pass?" Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

  14. You give your best players the ball. Our best players are our running backs. Green Bay’s best player is Rodgers. That’s why you take the ball out of Baker’s hands, especially with how he was playing. Stefanski deserves tons of blame for how that game went.

  15. I disagree with this take because it’s too black and white. What really matters here is the situational context. Having 3 timeouts with a minute left, getting 9 ypc or whatever. You run the ball. No timeouts, same situation? Totally different strategy

  16. exactly. Baker wants big money, and the Packers and every team will stack the box late in games to stop the running game until Baker is able to make them pay for that. These fake Browns fans rather he be the only QB in the league who gets to avoid this situation while getting 35-49 a year for some cult-like reason.

  17. I'm not going to touch the Baker stuff for the rest of the year, it is what it is at this point and whatever you believe we will see next year if he will continue to be our qb or not.

  18. My feelings EXACTLY. This guy was freaking COTY last year!!! And people want to blame him just to avoid blaming Baker when it’s beyond clear who the problem has been this year? It’s just insane to me

  19. I’m sure injuries are playing some sort of factor, but Bakers mechanics are simply broken. Footwork is atrocious. Every poor throw he makes is because his feet are going ways they shouldn’t be on follow through and finish. Here’s the interception on the over throw to Landry. How he got his feet this way is almost impossible. Didn’t point with his left. No follow through on right. Tried to use all arm and greatly misjudged.

  20. Would be interesting to see a comparison of his foot work from previous years compared to now. Yesterday, his throwing motion all looked so wonky and I don't recall that from the past

  21. He’s playing with one arm and he is a smaller QB who needs his whole body/torque to be strong/accurate.

  22. Ever since the injury you can see how bad his throws have become. If he only uses his arm strength he has been pretty accurate but when he needs to throw far or hard he either rotates to his left and misses the target point or his left shoulder dips at the point of release resulting in a high throw. Its subtle but its there.

  23. We need a kicker. That’s a 24-24 game in OT even with 4 INT’s if he just makes the damn layup PAT on our first TD which means we don’t go for 2 (and fail) on the next one.

  24. While I agree we definitely need to solidify the kicking spot, I find it hard to be mad at the rookie kicker making his NFL debut for going 1/2 on XP’s and 1/1 on FG’s when we turned the ball over 4 fucking times, including once in the red zone.

  25. You can’t change one event but still expect every single proceeding event to play out the exactly the same way. Nothing in that game happens the same way if he makes that kick.

  26. I’m both frustrated and positive this morning. Positive because we played a close game with the team many regard as being favourites to be one of the teams in the Super Bowl. Frustrated because we had 4 interceptions and generally odd play calls that I fear can implode the team on itself.

  27. That’s kind of how I feel. I get it’s next man up, but we haven’t been 100% the last two week and we really held our own last night. Shoulda, coulda, woulda at this point. Hopefully we can get a little help in the division today and kick ass the next two weeks.

  28. I get being an optimist but on the other side of the coin, anything above Bottom 5 QB play wins us that game. That was a terrible Baker game and it feels like he’s regressing rather than progressing. If it’s the injury, that’s one thing… but some of his reads are also terrible.

  29. Guess I’ll go put on my clown makeup and look up playoff scenarios to see who I need to root for today so I can get my hopes up again.

  30. It was nice seeing the offense click for the first time in months. We were consistently moving the ball all game, and that’s my biggest positive takeaway from yesterday.

  31. It was more than a few terrible decisions by baker. On the final drive alone he missed njoku twice. Once by throwing behind and then once by throwing ahead. Bakers decisions were bad and his execution was bad. He was one easy dropped interception away from throwing 5ints.

  32. i find it hard to believe the same crew who spotted the false start on Teller when he mistakenly took a breath pre-snap missed the guy hanging on DPJ for 5 yards.

  33. The problem isn't that the division is terrible, it's just htat everyone is painfully mediocre but also incredibly inconsistent. Every team has put up world-beating performances but also complete fucking stinkers. It doesn't make any sense. It's like a standoff between 4 prime Mike Tysons who all had three bags of laxatives before their fight against one another. They throw a couple of huge punches but mostly just shit all over the floor.

  34. How come Baker gets destroyed on crucial downs? He is always getting sacked and the line gets pushed back hard on these downs. How many third downs are we getting sacked out of FG range?

  35. Too many. Sometimes it as if he holds on too long to make a play but I think it comes down to them predictably passing on third and getting blown up. They ran on third and 10 yesterday and got 35!

  36. I dunno about blaming Stefanksi for not running at the very end. It was under a minute and we needed about 20-25 more yards and you have to be able to throw the ball in that spot. How many teams run a 2 minute drill of all runs?

  37. How can you blame him for calling pass plays that resulted in open receivers that baker flat out missed? You’ll do anything to avoid placing the blame on bakers failure to execute. Those are passes that an nfl starter HAS to make

  38. I disagree. He has shown what he is. The answer is certainly not Nick Mullens but it lies somewhere else and this front office will want to put its mark on the position.

  39. It’s all about Chubb and getting him yards at this point. And our defense does have pride in keeping offenses down. So while I think they won’t play for the win, what they care about should lead to a win

  40. There is a stark contrast between Baker's play, both statistically and how he looks pre injury vs post injury. Not only is he not as good at throwing but it's messing with him mentally. Time to write off this season. However, I have faith he can still turn it around.

  41. The biggest thing with Baker is his mechanics/fundamentals are shit right now. Fading back and throwing off his back foot, taking false steps in his drops, etc. Every time he goes to throw I have zero confidence where the ball is going to go. He’s all sorts of fucked up.

  42. Proud of the defense but no way on earth greedy should be covering elite receivers like Adams again that’s why we have a 2 time pro bowler on the other side. Overall I like Woods’s game plan against Green Bay but not having ward follow Adams was his one blemish

  43. We still have a shot at the playoffs somehow, but is it time to sit Baker for the rest of the season? Last night just showed that we can play with just about anyone but the offense holds us back. The missed DPI call was bad for sure, but if Baker doesn't throw three picks before that we probably have the lead in this game. I thought the defense played pretty well given all the turnovers, Joe Woods is going to get another year as DC and I hope we improve some more next season.

  44. Fuck the Refs, I’ll die on a hill that was holding/DPI. Absolute bullshit and the nfl needs to do a complete referee overhaul on how they officiate games.

  45. I don’t think that’s a hill you need to die on my man. Even packers fans are saying that was a clear penalty. Regardless, we would have been taking a knee and running out the clock there had we not butchered basically every other opportunity

  46. Yeah man, it's just fucked that the NFL shows penalities in replays, focuses in on them, sometimes the commentators even point it out...and nothing is done. Why?! It makes no sense. Implement the Sky Judge, until then I am honestly out. So sick of this bullshit.

  47. I'm going to agree. Regardless of the play call whether it should or shouldn't be a pass, it was not fairly called. The False start call followed by the non DPI call is just not presenting a fair game by the officials. I'm frustrated the Browns stunk but moreso the refs do not allow a fair game.

  48. I got my son (13) into the Browns, as most fans do. Over the last 5 years his fandom has grown, as most kids does when they start to get older and understand more of the game/team nuance. I said to him last night "u finally get it, this is the pain, welcome." Yes he saw 1-31, 2019s overhyped /underperformance ..

  49. Our defense played great. Baker was embarrassingly bad. Should have had 5 or 6 picks. Rodgers was probably 75% at best though so they would have probably put more points up if he was healthy. Davante Adams dropped a wide open pass for a 1st down too.

  50. I really want to like Baker, but if this is his audition for next year, he is not helping his case at all.

  51. Burrows is how a franchise QB should be. No excuses, shittt Oline, and still out there crushing it. While Baker needs everything to be perfect and still suck.

  52. Maybe one year we’ll be good enough so we don’t have to relay on other teams losing and not do playoff scenarios every fucking week lmao

  53. I think we all need to be realistic about a substantial upgrade at QB coming this offseason. It’s about as likely as our playoff chances. The FO is going to give Baker his last chance to prove he’s even a passable starter.

  54. Spare me your bullshit about the refs. Baker threw 4 picks and the packers scored 21 points off of it, that’s how this game was lost.

  55. To much people blame it all on the refs but that is simply not true, yes they missed calls. But when your QB throw 4 INTs you can’t win games simple as that

  56. I think I lost faith in being able to make the playoffs. We really need some new receivers and I hope next year the coaching staff is able to make better adjustments. I’m a diehard fan and this has been one tough season to watch.

  57. Baker gave up 21 points and a game winning drive to interceptions. That's why we lost, guys. Not the refs, not the kicker, not the play calling. Four turnovers.

  58. We're 12-3 with a good quarterback. Mayfield is average at best. This a really good team. We just need a quality QB. Baker isn't it.

  59. After yesterday I heard that Baker now leads the league in interceptions since 2018, surpassing Darnold. He's not getting any better at taking care of the ball. And the playcalling doesn't appear to be helping him either.

  60. I cannot in good faith look at this year and say baker is or isn’t the guy. How many injuries has he had this year? How banged up is his line? How many different receivers have they had in the top 3-4 slots this year?

  61. I just want to throw this out there, Baker has almost exactly the same states as Andy Dalton (it’s scary how close they’re). If you want to flounder in average land you stick with Baker Dalton.

  62. This year has shown me over and over again that despite the last 25 years I still don't know shit about football. Baker has regressed to garbage tier QB and so many Browns fans, myself included, argued that he wasn't. Congrats Baker now we have to agree with Cowherd and its all your fault.

  63. I dont care anymore, Baker Mayfield isnt a franchise QB and isnt worth an extension on this team. Two half seasons of good football do not make up for his inconsistency and inability to not turn into a skittish turnover machine

  64. Joe Woods once again did everything he needed to do to win the game. The problems with this team are offensive, and we all know it.

  65. I don't care about the play calling, or the refs. You can't throw 4 picks and expect to win. Mad props to the D for giving us a shot.

  66. As a franchise we have the worst luck in the damn world. We had the #1 overall pick a year too early. Joe Burrow is really damn good. I think he's the best QB in the division hands down.

  67. To me it’s clear why we are 7-8. We have had shit QB play all year long. Injuries or not he’s not playing good and hasn’t the entire season. Any reasonably decent QB this year has this team around 10-5 minimum.

  68. Browns had every chance to win that game. The defense did what they needed to do and the run game was unstoppable. The simple fact is Baker had four turnovers and three of them lead to Packer points. Blame the refs all you like but you can't win games turn the ball over that much. Baker lost us this game plain and simple.

  69. I can’t believe how many people are still defending Baker in other threads. Do we need a 5 int game for people to see the light?

  70. What a game yesterday. Even with the 4 INTs I still think Baker will get another year next year. The INTs were costly but outside of them he looked a lot better. His mechanics still are not fully there. He is struggling to throw left because of his shoulder

  71. Our defense actually did well yesterday considering we gave them 4 INT. We held an offense to 24 points that just dropped 31 against the Ravens and 36 against the Rams.

  72. They held Rodgers to 24 points and you’re complaining about the defense? With 21 off TOs? And praising bakers “mechanics” lmaooooooo

  73. It only matters what the Browns Front office thinks about Baker and it can’t be good. They have proven to be intelligent and bold. They will not be running this back next year without some serious changes on offense.

  74. This game has made me officially jump off the Baker train. I know they’re going to “evaluate the position” this off-season, but I kind of hope we lose the next 2 games so that they take a REALLY hard look or at least don’t have to pay him as much for an extension cus he is not the answer

  75. Is a healthy Baker and a WR or 2 that can generate separation and catch consistently the difference in all these close games

  76. I mean, on both interceptions where Baker targeted Landry, Landry found a seam in the zone and was wide open. Baker just missed them both. Threw one short to the underneath zone, and it got picked. Threw the other high to the safety over the top.

  77. Somehow all these other teams’ third string/practice squad QBs look better than our QB1. It’s time to move on.

  78. The more I think about it, the more I can’t even be mad at Baker. No nfl player is going to sit themselves on the bench because playing injured is hurting their team. No competitor will do that. To me it comes down to the coaching staff, you have to realize what you’re dealing with. Sorry Baker haters but we know he’s a better quarterback than this, he’s got a serious injury but unfortunately the coaching staff is putting too much faith in him and it has essentially cost us a whole season. Shut him down.

  79. Can you specifically explain how you think his injuries are impacting his performance? We keep hearing how his health has been improving, but yet when he struggles people go right back to playing the injury card.

  80. Baker sucked and lost us that game. Glad we have one more year to decide on his contract if there’s to be one at all. Even if he balls out next year and proves he deserves a contact, this year and his 2019 year may be enough to get us a better team deal. That’s how I’m choosing to look at it at least. I hope he proves he can be the guy because I really don’t see any better realistic options. This is an easy playoff team with a better than average QB. If he was able to carry on from how he ended last year I think we win 2-3 more games, probably more. It’s frustrating that he couldn’t prove it this year, but he’s still got time. Holding out hope but i don’t see it happening. Next year is the last chance and hopefully we can get a contingency plan in place just in case. This team is gonna be even worse with most of the other realistic QB options out there.

  81. A quote from Top Gun: "Your ego is writing checks your body can't cash." That's also applicable to Baker Mayfield. Baker is an ego-sensitive individual who constantly attempts to prove his arm is as strong and as accurate as the best in the NFL. It leads him to make ill-advised decisions and--on-occasion with a screaming tailwind component-- to demonstrate he can throw a football really far. That's kid stuff.

  82. The Baker ego problem isn’t discussed enough with Reddit Browns fans. I constantly see posts mentioning his “toughness”, “leadership”, & “energy” yet I believe he causes more harm than good to the Browns culture. Baker fans that swoon over his personality are likely the same fans that have a Manziel jersey in the backs of their closet. In my opinion, I believe the Browns would benefit from a composed, intelligent athlete that plays consistently. But again, this is coming from one fan’s perspective. My favorite player is Nick Chubb, not only for his freakish physical ability but for his humble & focused mind.

  83. A lot needs to happen in this off-season. We need to draft a receiver in the first round or see if we can get a star in free agency. We 100% need to find a good kicker. We don't need a super star kicker like tucker, but we need someone who we can trust to make the easy kicks. I thought Mclaughlin was that guy but he's just been a wreck lately. Then we need to resign Ward. Not sure what's taking so long on his contract but he's worth the money.

  84. Someone in the game thread tried to make the case that Baker is ok this year “Because he hasn’t thrown as many picks as Mahomes.” I just want to know… how drunk were you yesterday?

  85. NFL officiating cost us the chance to win this game. Sure Baker played pretty roughly. However three big no-calls completely changed the complexion of this game. On the first INT there was a blatant hold, which held up the receiver and in turn did not allow him to make a play on the ball. Prior to the second INT there was a face mask on Baker that wasn’t called that resulted in a sack. Then the most egregious was that last non call where DPJ was being held, and the DB literally used the receiver to propel himself for the INT.

  86. If I were a coach, my rant would probably get me suspended. My day after game press conference would be a montages of all the egregious missed calls for the year. I would be cussing refs and the lack of accountability with them.

  87. This is what is driving me crazy. People bitching about Baker throwing four INTs and acting like he threw it to the receiver on purpose. We have receivers out there getting hugged like it's the national friendship league instead of football league and not being able to make plays due to it. We have receivers out there slipping and sliding all over the field the whole game. We have defenders checking out players jersey size during the game and the refs aren't saying shit.

  88. I'm so sick and damn tired of being on the wrong end of bad officiating. We got one QB on the field and yes he made a couple mistakes. But there is a team of officials on the field and for them to all miss something so egregious not once but multiple times, well I don't know if I can keep watching this.

  89. The NFL is a complete joke and I'm done watching and caring. I'll check the Browns scores from here on out but I'm not taking time out of my day to watch this shitty product of predetermined outcomes and one-sided reffing.

  90. God, I know he threw 4 picks, but it's hard to stay mad at Baker this morning. He also converted on THREE 3rd down and 10+s, which is such a huge difference from what our backups are capable of, and had us in position to win the game at the end against the best team in the league on the road

  91. I mean that’s why Keenum/Mullens are backups for a reason. At the same time, I can’t look past 3 INTs to say “At least he gave us a chance at the end… only to do what he seemingly always does, not lead a game winning drive, and throw a 4th INT.”

  92. That 1 hurt. I really hope we can somehow land one of the big name proven QBs next season, and yes I know that’s unlikely before you guys jump down my throat. Heartbreaking season. Maybe next year boys

  93. Baker has helped this franchise, but are you honestly, truly telling me that this is it? What about at 110% Baker? Just because he’s better than what we’ve had doesn’t mean he’s franchise. Love the guy, but if I have to watch one more last-chance drive turnover I’m going to jump off a cliff. Kevin is also terrible at the end of the game. What happened to these two?

  94. Hire Joe Woods! Defense balled out. Baker had an awful game, that can happens against really good teams. I haven’t lost hope in him though, but I can understand internet coaches getting frustrated. I like how we used the Schwartz, he looks like he’s ready to contribute more. Can’t really be mad about the L, we had em where we wanted em and we let em off the hook!

  95. Our QB sucks and our receivers also suck. I’m not even mad about about the refs because if we had any good WR they don’t get touched off the line and probably get open on that pass at the end.

  96. I will be the first to criticize Baker when it’s needed but asking for Cam is crazy talk lol. Baker will be back next year and then a decision will be made.

  97. Frustrating game but nice to see our back up guys stepping up. At this point I'm just ready for next year to see what a healthy Baker can do and if Stef can learn from this poorly coached season. I have hope both can turn it around, and if not I got faith in Berry to navigate the appropriate options. Go Browns!

  98. I will defend an injured Baker not being able to show what he is capable of. That happens and I think he deserves a shot when healthy next year. I won't defend an injured Baker being put in there when there's a very good chance the backup and third string options give the team a better chance to win.

  99. The fact the coaches prefer to put an injured Baker in over a healthy Keenum/Mullens tells you all you need to know about the backups.

  100. It’s almost like stats are completely against us too. That many close games decided by 1 score, you’d think we’d have a few more wins and instead of so many losses

  101. It’s time to get rid of on field refs. These geriatric MFers can’t get anything right. We have the tech to remove human error from the game. Do it.

  102. I know we have some chance of making playoffs but at this point, Baker needs to sit. He says he's healthy but the way he was throwing yesterday was....weird. which made him bad.

  103. So what other teams are we wanting to win for any shot for a playoff chance? (Plz don't tear me apart, just curious... I am not thinking we will make playoffs just curious...)

  104. You know, despite all the heartbreak, BS calls, and black or white fans, I still wouldn’t trade being a Browns fan for anything. I love this team win or lose

  105. Cleveland’s luck: Browns will roll with Baker next year without a contract. Baker will have a career year and leave us. That would be so Cleveland. The other possibility is he leaves and another coach unlocks his potential. Either way it seems the Browns are screwed. They run Baker back next year and hope Baker turns it around, but we’ve seen healthy Baker throw a fair share of picks. You dump him and then you’re wasting future draft capital that should be going to a receiver

  106. He was great pulling on running plays. Thought he acquitted himself well. Tretter is very good but with all the lower leg issues he’s had his mobility is somewhat compromised

  107. Man this season is FAR from over. We have a great shot at getting in to the playoffs as long as we go 2-0 vs Squealers/Bumgles. I think we have a great shot at both games.

  108. And to reply to my own comment, if we get a wild card berth all this bullshit means nothing. All the fuckery from covid, refs, etc.. is out the window. Let's fucking GOOO

  109. Rooting for this team is bad for my health. There's some relief that it's already over. What a horrible, forgettable season

  110. Baker would still not be able to hit those receivers Bengals got. Baker just don't have the heart, vision and long ball accuracy of Burrows.

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